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Money stress hits differently when you’re also managing chronic illness. In this episode, Nikita sits down with money coach Aqura Nicholson to unpack money trauma and explore practical steps for creating financial stability. From breaking the paycheck-to-paycheck cycle to building a cushion without compromising health, Aqura and Nikita dive into shifting mindsets and tangible ways to start saving and earning, even when finances feel tight. Join us to learn how to move from stress and survival mode to financial confidence.
What You’ll Learn:
- Practical steps to overcome money trauma and break free from paycheck-to-paycheck cycles
- Tips for talking about money without fear or shame, especially with chronic illness
- How to approach debt management without feeling overwhelmed or restricted
- Realistic ways to start saving, even on a tight budget
- When and how to think about bringing in extra income to meet financial needs
- Creating a financial plan that aligns with your unique health and lifestyle needs
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Subscribe to the Chronically Profitable: The Flare-Proof Path to $100K, A free exclusive weekly email series designed for creatives and women with chronic illnesses. You'll learn how to make a liveable income with your hobbies, professional skills, and innate talents by building a successful online coaching business with simple strategies that work for you, even on flare days and feel better living with chronic illness.
00:00 - Navigating Money and Chronic Illness
13:26 - Breaking the Paycheck-to-Paycheck Cycle
18:13 - Breaking the Cycle of Financial Fear
24:14 - Overcoming Money Trauma, Embracing Possibility
30:52 - Navigating Financial Independence and Wellness
39:51 - Navigating Debt and Building Savings
46:44 - Clarifying Savings Strategies for Financial Wellness
54:43 - Shame, Budgets, and Financial Wellness
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A quick note before we begin.
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Some of the topics in this episode may be sensitive or triggering.
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Please listen with care and remember it's okay to pause, skip or seek support if anything feels overwhelming.
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Also, the information shared here is for educational and informational purposes only.
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Coaching, like the guidance shared here in this episode, focuses on self-reflection and actionable steps, and it's meant to be therapeutic, but not medical or therapy support.
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Your well-being is the priority as you listen, so take care.
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Welcome to Business with Chronic Illness, the globally ranked podcast for women living with chronic illness who want to start and grow a business online.
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I'm your host.
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Nikita Williams and I went from living a normal life to all of a sudden being in constant pain, with no answers to being diagnosed with multiple chronic illnesses and trying to make a livable income.
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To make a livable income, I faced the challenge of adapting traditional business advice to fit my unique circumstances, with chronic illness, feeling frustrated and more burned out than I already was.
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While managing my chronic illness to becoming an award-winning coach with a flexible, sustainable online coaching business, I found the surprisingly simple steps to starting and growing a profitable business without compromising my health or my peace.
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Since then, I've helped dozens of women just like you learn how to do the same.
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If you're ready to create a thriving business that aligns with your lifestyle and well-being, you're in the right place.
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Together, we're shifting the narrative of what's possible for women with chronic illness and how we make a living.
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This is Business with Chronic Illness.
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Hello everyone, I'm so excited about this episode with Akira, our money coach, our expert on money.
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I should say I'm excited to have her on.
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If you've been following me on Instagram.
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You know that we've done a live recently and I just thought we should have more conversation about money.
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I don't know about all of you who are listening, but one of the biggest questions I feel like a lot of my clients have with me, and I've even had with my coach, is like why do I have such a hard time with money?
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Why does it feel so stressful?
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How do I kind of approach money from a neutral standpoint?
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Why do I feel physically certain ways when we start talking about money?
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What are some of those things?
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And I think, as chronic illness warriors, it's something that we all want to kind of feel a little bit more empowered by.
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All want to kind of feel a little bit more empowered by versus not, and so I thought why not have Akira on the show?
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So I'm so glad she's here and, yeah, let's welcome you.
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Welcome.
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Thank you, nikita, thanks for having me on your show.
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I always like when we get together, we always come up with some new gems, so I'm excited to hear what they will be today.
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Girl, let me tell you about new gems for a second.
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Our live that we did got me.
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You know it's so fascinating when you go into a space and you're thinking about the thing you know well, like you have.
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You're a money coach, you know money, you think about money a very specific way and you've kind of got your world with it and I think about running a business with chronic illness and in my very specific way, and you've kind of got your world with it and I think about running a business with chronic illness and in my very specific way.
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But hearing you talk about something in our conversation or alive made me like have this whole new, like pivot in my brain.
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Not a pivot, it was more of like a way of talking about chronic illness and it created a whole new concept.
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I've been loving it, but it literally is because of you and I was like she got me sparked over here, talking about, like the phases of where you are with your money and it had me thinking about you know, living with chronic illness, how we're in different phases, and it's led to this whole new like giving yourself grace and understanding about where you might be, what expectations you should be having or ones that are not serving you.
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And I think again just kind of bring it full circle back to talking about money and how it shows up for us and how we feel about things.
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Man, are we all in different phases when it comes to money?
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How do you feel about like money in general, money in general?
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How do you feel about like money in general?
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Money in general.
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It's funny that you ask, because I just feel so unbothered by just talking about money, like I wish that, instead of asking someone and it's funny because we were when we were in the green room, nikita and I were talking about how everyone's like how are you doing today?
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I feel like we should be at a point where, like how's your money today?
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How are you doing with your money today?
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Like I want that to be the new norm just to talk about your money in a normal conversation, not to be ashamed about it, to say I'm doing well with saving.
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I'm struggling with savings right now.
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I'm trying to earn more money.
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I'm trying to bring in more money in my business.
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I am bringing in more money finally in my business.
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Whatever the thing is, I wish we could just talk about it more, because then and I think this is probably what happened to you, nikita it's so much weight that's lifted and it gives you that much more space to think and you probably just had more space to think because you weren't subconsciously stressed about money and I know we'll get into it later.
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But a lot of that comes from money trauma and understanding what that is, how that impacts you and how a lot of times we're just operating out of fear.
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So when people ask me, like what do I think about, I'm like let's talk, let's get into it.
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Like what do I want to talk about today?
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Retirement investing, saving like what's the thing Debt?
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Hey, retirement investing, saving like what's the thing?
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Debt?
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So I'm always ready to go.
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Oh my goodness, that alone is just a mic drop of like yeah, why can't we just talk about money, like how's your day?
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Like when you said that, I was like I don't know if I'm on that level with you yet.
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Akira.
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Cause I'd be like I don't know, I don't know if I want to talk about that right now.
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Yeah, and even for me I feel like this is a good moment for me to be very transparent about even though I'm a money coach everything is not perfect.
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I am still trying to figure out the best way to build my savings as an entrepreneur.
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That is not something that I ever had an issue with when I was working a nine to five.
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So if the listeners don't know, I'm an engineer.
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I worked in the nuclear industry for six years.
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It was very I put constant, I put money in my savings.
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I put money like it was just very steady.
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And now I'm like how do I figure this out as a business owner?
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And I think, now that this is my second year, it's becoming more clear to do it in a way that feels good and to shy away from feeling like it's only right if I did it in the same way I did it at my nine to five.
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So like that's where I am with my money and it's not perfect.
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And I think a lot of people feel like, because you're a money coach before you, because you like talking about money, everything's perfect.
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Like no, I'm figuring it out too, because there's new stuff that I face every day, but it doesn't mean that I can't adjust certain ways of thinking, certain ways, certain habits that I have in order to still achieve the goals that I want to achieve.
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I mean you had it on.
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I think that's I love that you brought that out.
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I think we all put once we are a label.
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I think it's this weird paradox, even as coaches, as people who are like this is what you do, like there's this part of us that, like we know we're not, we're not perfect, we're not like got this a hundred percent, figure it out.
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We might be like maybe a couple of stairs or staircases above you, maybe we might even be in another building that you ain't got into yet, but we still have our own things we haven't figured out.
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And I think it's important, especially when it comes to money, to be vulnerable in that way and share that.
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I think we should be like that in all areas.
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I'd be telling my clients all the time, just because I'm on here on social media talking about thinking about going to hospital and doing all this other stuff and growing a business don't mean I don't have bad days where I'm like sitting in the corner crying, being like why is this so hard?
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Like it's real talk, and I think to your point, I think we all, as experts or leaders, should have room for this fact that it is still kind of messy in some parts of our, our journey Right, and that's okay.
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Exactly, I agree a hundred percent.
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So let's talk about your journey.
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Let's talk about your journey for a minute, about money, like so you were just saying you, your background is like working full time.
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Are you still working full time?
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No, I left in the end of 2022.
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That was my 2022 goal.
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How did you get there?
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Oh, that's funny.
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So let me go back.
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Where I truly come from is always being used to living in paycheck to paycheck cycle, so much so that I didn't even know that it wasn't normal for other people to not do the same thing.
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Okay, because my parents growing up were always talking about how there will just never be enough money, no matter how much money they were earning.
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My mom she's a respiratory therapist.
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She worked night shifts, so she'd have night shift differential.
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She worked overtime.
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We were at home a lot of times, but, like, she was always working.
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My dad was always working and I'm like the math is not math.
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How is this possible?
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Of college, right?
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So, first of all, I chose an engineering degree because typically they were known to have high incomes, right?
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And for me, I was like if I could just earn a lot of money, then I will not have to live paycheck to paycheck.
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So I realized, when I started making my own money, I didn't know what to do with that money.
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I did not know what like.
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I truly didn't know why you should even save money, because the only time I saw any saving happening in my house is when we were moving from like townhome to townhome and we needed the first month's rent and like the deposit right, or we were buying a house, like it always was this big goal.
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It was never just like you just have a habit of saving for things that might come up for a rainy day, for a sinking fund, and so when I started making my own money, I was just spending it.
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I was just doing the same thing that I saw, the same thing that I was used to doing, and it wasn't until I realized that the little things that I should be saving from like, oh, this is why it's OK to save money, and like, oh, this is why investing is important, because you don't have to have a million dollars just sitting in the bank.
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You can have X amount invested in 40 years it is a million.
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So just those basic financial literacy skills.
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I truly had no idea.
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So, even though I was earning money as an engineer so I talk about I went from zero to 62K at 22,.
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I was spending that 62K.
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I had little to no expenses.
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I moved back in with my parents they let me stay there rent free, like I didn't have a car payment.
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I'm like I don't know where that money was going.
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Clothes, shoes, hair lashes, nails, like all the stuff that people just spend money on.
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I was like, yeah, I can do that now and I don't have to ask permission.
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Or like ask my mom to help or ask my dad to help 62K at 22 and I was living paycheck to paycheck until I realized that one I was in a paycheck to paycheck cycle still, even though I was making good money or even though I was a high income earner.
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And it had nothing to do with the amount, it had everything to do with how you were managing it.
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So that's really kind of my background and my money story.
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Akira, oh Akira, like who the heck am I outside of?
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You know chronic illness, like what's my vibe, what's my style?
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You'll always be seeing me talking about what to wear.
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I'm in the era of, like, what is Nikita's life right?
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And so when you're over here talking about paycheck to paycheck and you went like from zero to 62, but you was living at home, I was like this sounds very familiar, but in a different way, because I, you know, I'm married at my husband and I we have experienced that often.
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Where we're like in a, we're like how, how, how are we still feeling like we live in paycheck to paycheck and yet we make in more.
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But but also we know expenses are higher.
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But also I know where the money's going, but I don't understand it where the money is going.
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But I don't understand it and I think it's interesting how what you're saying is that it's not necessarily that you need more money.
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You need to know how to handle the money you have.
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Exactly.
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And that happens at any income level, because someone that's earning 50k can be in the same paycheck to paycheck cycle as someone who is earning 250K.
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And how I describe this is if any one of these four things are true, then you're living paycheck to paycheck, regardless of how much money you earn.
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So if any of your money left over after bills is not being used intentionally towards like plan spending or debt payoff or like whatever your goal is, because you don't know where your money is going, or you don't know your numbers, if you're going into more and more debt each month, if known things that's coming up, whether it's Christmas, whether it's like property taxes or like car maintenance or home maintenance, it's putting you back financially every time they come up because you're not strategically planning for them.
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Or you're just like not able to make consistent progress towards whether it's your savings goals, investing goals, that payoff goals.
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And how this looks is that you'll put money in savings for, let's say, down payment on a home, but you got to put it back out two weeks later because something comes up.
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Or you're paying off a credit card, but two months later it's maxed out again.
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So like you can't make that consistent progress to actually achieve that financial goal.
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So if any one of those four things are true, then you are in a paycheck to paycheck cycle, because now you need that next paycheck or that next, you know, business owner distribution or owner's draw or whatever in order to now backfeed what you missed or now needed to make up for it.
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And so it keeps you just like going forward, then going back, going forward, then going back, which is ultimately a cycle.
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And I think that people struggle with that term and identifying with it, because it's like oh, I earned too much money to be in a paycheck to paycheck cycle, or I'm not broke, or I'm earning 30K more than I was before.
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Like that that can't be true.
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And really it's, there's no shame.
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Like that's it just is what it is.
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And I think that's what I mean by like just being unbothered by it, like unbothered by money.
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It's like, yeah, that's just what it is, so now I can strategically get out of it, so I don't have to keep being in that same cycle.
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I love that you explained it like that, because that's how I feel about chronic illness.
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I feel like there's this shame around that you have like flare ups that you might have a bad season, like I'm in this season right now where I have a lot of unknown health stuff going on and I don't feel any shame talking about it because I'm like this is it's called chronic illness for a reason, like it's it's never going to be like gone.
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If it does and if there's a cure, I'm all for it, but like right now that's what it is, versus being like I'm all for it, but like right now that's what it is, versus being like I have done something wrong in the sense of being, like I caused this and something you mentioned earlier which is like financial literacy.
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I think in general, we never got this education, so the shame is kind of like sometimes we feel like we should know, but no one ever really taught us this stuff.
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Like you went to school.
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I remember in high school I think I maybe have had had like one class and it was like one lesson on accounting or something like like checkbooks or something like what's in your, what's your routing number and what's your checking number.
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What does a checkbook look like?
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Like this is high school stuff and I just think about, like even in college we talked about money but we didn't actually talk about managing money.
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We talked about how it looks like in the big world, but not when you drill down into okay, what does this look like for me when I get my paycheck Right?
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And so to your point.
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If we can just first give ourselves space to be like, hey, I don't know, or this is part of what happens when you don't know and start working with it, it's kind of like when I tell my clients with chronic illness I'm like you know that chronic illness is a thing you're in halfway up, so you're going to have issues, so let's just plan for it, let's just look for a way to work with it.
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And I think that's what you're kind of also saying with the money part, right, like it's.
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Like you know you might be having this cycle.
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It doesn't mean anything about you, it just means like okay, we need to adjust some things.
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So if someone's listening to that, I'm like girl, but how do I get over the shame?
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Because I feel like people will be looking at me like what you mean?
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You paycheck to paycheck and you make it a hundred and or 60 or whatever, like how does someone from a body holistic standpoint get out of that money?
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Trauma that a lot of us are experiencing.
00:17:52.819 --> 00:18:01.916
So it's interesting that you bring this up, because I was just like doing sometimes, I just like write out what are some things that I want to talk about, and I was just writing about this.
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I need to talk about what it looks like to really address some of those things because of how much different you will approach whatever you're trying to do with your money.
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So, for example, at the beginning of every year, everybody want to build a budget.
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If I want to build a budget, you want to stop spending $800 a month on food.
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So what do you do?
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You download the app, you buy a planner, you make a spreadsheet, right, you cut your budget to $400 a month instead of $800 a month by January 21st.
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It is nowhere to be found why?
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Because there was no intentionality about why am I not able to quote, unquote stick to a budget, if that's really the problem, right, which typically is not the problem?
00:18:52.086 --> 00:18:57.006
Or why do I feel so much anxiety when I even sit down to do a budget?
00:18:57.006 --> 00:19:00.333
Why can I only do this at the beginning of the year?
00:19:00.333 --> 00:19:02.744
Even when I do sit down to do this?
00:19:02.744 --> 00:19:04.288
How do I actually feel?
00:19:04.288 --> 00:19:06.393
Or what am I afraid of?
00:19:06.393 --> 00:19:12.461
And I was just talking to someone the other day and she was like I just want to pay my house off in 10 years.
00:19:12.461 --> 00:19:15.348
We bought in 2021 and I want to be done in 10 years.
00:19:15.348 --> 00:19:18.000
And 10 years kept coming up, coming up, coming up.
00:19:18.000 --> 00:19:21.226
And I said why are you putting 10 years on it?
00:19:21.226 --> 00:19:24.510
And she she started crying.
00:19:24.510 --> 00:19:45.819
I just asked her that simple question and she said every job I've been at at the 10 year mark, I've even I've gotten laid off, so she's operating out of fear now because, she's scared that at 10 years she might not be bringing in an income anymore.
00:19:45.940 --> 00:19:50.071
So she wants to have the biggest line item taken care of, which is her mortgage.
00:19:50.071 --> 00:20:01.506
But if I would have never asked her that question, she would have kept going 10 years, 10 years, 10 years, whatever it takes.
00:20:01.506 --> 00:20:08.125
And she was telling me it's causing her to accrue more debt because she's making an extra mortgage payment which is eating up her cash.
00:20:08.125 --> 00:20:21.491
So sometimes you really have to sit with why you are doing what you're doing with money and if you don't, you will keep doing that thing, keep operating out of fear and not even getting to where you want to get to.
00:20:21.491 --> 00:20:24.906
So that's what the difference looks like.
00:20:32.099 --> 00:20:37.252
So now she can actually take that extra mortgage payment and use it to start building up some cash so she doesn't have to go deeper into debt and she can still pay off her mortgage early.
00:20:37.599 --> 00:20:40.969
It might not be in 10 years, or maybe it will be, because she can double her salary.
00:20:40.969 --> 00:21:01.729
There are so many ways to pay off your mortgage in 10 years, but if you try to jam pack it before you get out of the paycheck to paycheck cycle, you're just going to keep taking the paycheck to paycheck cycle to the next income level, and so that's what it looks like when someone truly sits with.
00:21:01.729 --> 00:21:04.574
How does my body feel when I talk about this thing?
00:21:04.574 --> 00:21:08.684
Why am I still working at this X amount of years later?
00:21:09.406 --> 00:21:12.434
Why do I still have shame about this same thing?
00:21:12.434 --> 00:21:15.701
Why am I repeating the same things my parents did?
00:21:17.003 --> 00:21:19.547
That's such a good point.
00:21:19.547 --> 00:21:21.609
Akira Akira, that was so good.
00:21:21.609 --> 00:21:22.791
I'm like Akira Akira, that was so good.
00:21:22.791 --> 00:21:24.673
I'm like woo, that's good and spicy.
00:21:24.733 --> 00:22:01.798
I feel like I I feel that for the women and the people listening to this episode specifically who have trauma connected to the reason why they're in debt, and I'm I'm very upfront with people and I'm like, yeah, I have tons of medical debt Like it's not a joke, like if you had spent the first five years of your marriage, literally when you were literally just out of high school, college, and you ain't got no job, job, you ain't got no job and you go from like living a normal life to being in the hospital three or four times a month.
00:22:01.798 --> 00:22:06.651
Okay, you're gonna rack up some medical debt.
00:22:06.651 --> 00:22:10.569
There is no ifs, ands or buts about it.
00:22:10.569 --> 00:22:11.451
It's gonna happen.
00:22:11.451 --> 00:22:18.430
And I think a lot of times, because the way that we view that, we view that, oh, we are irresponsible.
00:22:18.430 --> 00:22:30.527
And so when other things come up, like you know, like you were saying, like I need to pay off my house or I need to pay off this car so I can have more money for this treatment or that treatment, or even in your business, like I need to make this amount of money.
00:22:30.527 --> 00:22:31.464
I have a client.
00:22:31.464 --> 00:22:43.685
I have a client who wants to, like, hold onto money, like, so, like the thought of an expense or an investment is.
00:22:43.685 --> 00:22:48.348
We do a lot of work to get to the point of being like, okay, I'm ready to release that.
00:22:48.348 --> 00:22:49.186
And I do think a lot of work to get to the point of being like, okay, I'm ready to release that.
00:22:49.788 --> 00:22:57.023
And I do think a lot of this has to do with our thoughts about how, like you said, how are we feeling about money in our body?
00:22:57.023 --> 00:23:00.951
And then how does that show up in reality?
00:23:00.951 --> 00:23:05.186
Like what does that thought, that feeling, create in your reality?
00:23:05.186 --> 00:23:20.290
And to your point, she could have sold I mean she could have, she could pay off her mortgage by not going in debt in a completely different way than what she was doing and probably way more efficiently, if she just accepted that.
00:23:20.290 --> 00:23:22.982
That's the reason why she was approaching it that way.
00:23:22.982 --> 00:23:24.807
So I I am with you.
00:23:24.867 --> 00:23:29.201
That's that same thought process that we, we kind of learn in some mindset work around.
00:23:29.201 --> 00:23:40.114
The thought that you are having is creating the result that you likely don't even want, which is more debt, more stress, more paycheck to paycheck cycle.
00:23:40.114 --> 00:23:42.941
You're just rehearsing the same thing.
00:23:42.941 --> 00:23:48.930
And so when you think about that with clients and for yourself in your journey, when was that flipped?
00:23:48.930 --> 00:23:51.493
When did that with clients and for yourself and your journey?
00:23:51.493 --> 00:24:01.243
When was that flipped Like, when did that thought shift, change for you to being like, oh yeah, I'm in a cycle and now I need to change it.
00:24:01.243 --> 00:24:05.711
And how does that feel in my body, like, how did you shift into where you feel like you are normally baseline neutral with it?
00:24:05.731 --> 00:24:08.136
are normally baseline neutral with it.
00:24:08.136 --> 00:24:11.808
Yeah so, nikita, it truly took me three years to get out of that cycle.
00:24:14.021 --> 00:24:57.045
The main reason because I didn't want to acknowledge I was in that cycle because here I am an engineer, right, because we were so like because we're so special or whatever, or because we make so much money, or because we're so smart, or like because I, we make so much money, or because we're so smart, or like because I know math well, like all these right, because I'm supposed to be better with numbers, because I'm an engineer, so a lot of it was just not wanting to acknowledge the fact that I was in a paycheck to paycheck cycle and trying to like fight against it and show that I wasn't by doing all the things getting my hair done, buying the clothes, going out with friends, like showing up in a way that people not living paycheck to paycheck supposedly should show up.
00:24:57.045 --> 00:25:06.729
But then I'm like, but I shouldn't be excited to get up at five o'clock in the morning just to check my bank account, cause the direct deposit is there.
00:25:06.729 --> 00:25:11.105
Like why, why am I doing this?
00:25:11.105 --> 00:25:14.160
Yeah, I'm like this is silly, like.
00:25:14.740 --> 00:25:15.823
I really had to start.
00:25:15.823 --> 00:25:22.595
And you start seeing how what you're doing, Just like why, yeah?
00:25:22.595 --> 00:25:42.675
And I had to just get honest about I was repeating the same exact things that I was questioning about my parents when I was growing up and, just like seeing that mirror reflection, I was like, OK, either I got to figure this out or this is just going to continue to happen.
00:25:43.280 --> 00:25:43.401
And.
00:25:43.721 --> 00:25:45.905
I don't want it to be the case.
00:25:45.905 --> 00:25:49.773
I remember going to when I was little.
00:25:49.773 --> 00:25:52.788
We always lived in like a town home.
00:25:52.788 --> 00:25:55.885
We didn't buy our first house until I was probably in high school.
00:25:55.885 --> 00:26:22.083
And I remember being in elementary school and I went to a friend's birthday party and her house was so I was like how it had multiple levels and I remember being like how do people I literally couldn't make sense of it, because it's just something that was so out of my world and I'm like, but it and like.
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